The B Team Podcast
Talking all things Business, Bentonville, and Bourbon. Hosted by Josh Saffran, Matt Marrs, and Rob Nelson. New episodes every Thursday!
The B Team Podcast
Bourbon Tasting: Penelope Wheated Four Grain
Ever find yourself hunting down allocated bourbon unicorns while walking right past remarkable bottles hiding in plain sight? You're not alone.
The B-Team's latest bourbon exploration uncovers the exceptional Penelope Bourbon Wheated Four Grain expression, sparking genuine excitement rarely seen from our resident whiskey expert. At just $45, this unassuming bottle delivers a perfectly balanced experience that rivals bottles costing five times as much. "If I was judging this in competition, I'd give this a solid gold medal on a blind test," our expert declares, genuinely surprised by the quality in his glass.
This discovery leads us into a fascinating discussion about bourbon's four fundamental grains: corn, rye, wheat, and malted barley. We break down how the delicate balance between these components creates distinctive flavor profiles, and why Penelope's strategic emphasis on being a wheated bourbon positions it alongside sought-after brands like Weller and Maker's Mark. The craftsmanship here is undeniable – sweet corn notes blend harmoniously with aromatic wheat characteristics and just enough rye spice to create complexity without overwhelming the palate.
The conversation inevitably turns to bourbon snobbery and how social media has trained enthusiasts to chase particular brands while overlooking exceptional options. Russ shares how his friend walked past Russell's Reserve "a hundred times" thinking it looked cheap, only to discover it was his favorite in a premium whiskey lineup. As allocated bottles become increasingly scarce, perhaps it's time we all expand our horizons and judge whiskey by what's in the glass rather than what's on the label. Next time you're browsing bourbon shelves, we challenge you to pick up something unfamiliar – that unassuming bottle might just blow away your expectations!
Welcome to the B-Team Podcast. I am your host, josh Saffron, with my co-host, matt Morris and our permanent guest, rob Nelson. We're here every week to talk to you about all things Bentonville, bourbon and business the B-Team Podcast Be here. Welcome to the B-Team Podcast, bourbon Edition. I'm your host, josh Safran, my co-host, matt Marr. Like how I threw the bourbon edition, I did, I did.
Speaker 2:This is like the Monday just bourbon, I think. Well, and I think you're trying to emphasize bourbon edition, because you didn't set up the person that was supposed to be here right now.
Speaker 1:Well, that's a whole other. We won't even get to that today, because that's just going to drag us down backwards. We get a lot of good feedback. Russ, always welcome. We get a lot of good feedback. I'm pulling out seven to ten minutes of bourbon content, specifically on a Monday when you have the OG here.
Speaker 2:We've heard a bunch. What I think it really is is they like Russ and not us so much?
Speaker 1:They tolerate us they like Russ?
Speaker 2:Yes, we're the gateway to Russ, if someone likes me.
Speaker 3:That's very impressive. They don't like you too fine gentleman.
Speaker 1:Well, it's more me. They all love Matt, Like the 60 to 80-year-old women demographic that watches HGTV. They all fall in love with Matt.
Speaker 3:Oh, we saw that in Kentucky we did Instantly. I mean they did not care that we were at Four Roses going through a Tasty and it was Rob's fault.
Speaker 1:It was actually Brewer's fault. It was Brewer's fault. Hey, you guys are from Benville. Oh my God, do you know the Mars family from the Fix it or Fabulous show?
Speaker 3:Yeah, they're in the back. Shout out to Brewers. Okay, so that's right. But I think Rob tried to be coy about it. He just wanted to be laid low. Well, so did I, but also, you were like honey, you know.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but remember that we went to Heaven Hill and the lady recognized him as well. Mac was sweet, I'm going to get Heaven Hill 18. And she's like no, but I'll take a picture with you, which I thought was hysterical. Yeah, but it's great to be here with you too.
Speaker 2:My gentlemen, it's been good to see you. You're the bionic man.
Speaker 3:You're out doing things you can't even tell I am 2% on my knee for being back to totally straight 2% and, as the doctor says, the last 2% of raised emotion is the most difficult. But I'm going through it every day and I'm not lumpy. You noticed when I walked in.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm not lumpy. That is 2% away from being totally straight also. So I mean it's perfect, I mean it's our passion when we get to our age.
Speaker 3:You know, we'll take it out. We'll take what we can get. Boys, this is going to light up a lot up the screen.
Speaker 1:What are we drinking?
Speaker 2:today, boys. So we're drinking Penelope Bourbon and it's a new weeded that they came out with. It's a four grain, and before we started the cameras, russ asked Josh and I what the four grains were. I have no idea. Do we get to one Wheat? Well, I mean, barley, I think there's at least wheat and there's. We've talked about this before.
Speaker 3:Okay, go ahead. Primary grains that go into whiskey in America, Malted barley you have to malted barley, Check that the enzymes start to break down during fermentation. And then you've got corn, obviously, and we've got rye. We've got rye and then we have the wheat. So wheat, rye and barley. There's no such thing as fructose or syrup for those three syrups because they're very bone dry in comparison to corn, which we all know. Corn is a sweet driver because you've got corn fructose and corn syrup. So this is a nice balance. This is the first time I've had this. I saw this the other day on the shelf. I go, I need to get some.
Speaker 1:What's the retail price? Because when Matt buys and brings something in, I always think it's in like the $30 and $40 range.
Speaker 2:I believe you probably buy this. I think it's like mid-40s, like $42 or $44.
Speaker 3:I've seen it in Texas from 45 to 55. I saw it in Memphis a couple weeks ago, right around a nut ball.
Speaker 1:So you notice how I knew that, because if Rob would have brought it it would have been like in the $200 range.
Speaker 2:but Matt's saying but I do have a question for you. Russ, yes, so do all bourbons have the four grains?
Speaker 3:No, so, like this is a wheat, so the primary driver grain on this is the wheat, you know, along with the corn. But when you see, like Maker's Mark, they don't promote themselves as a weeded bourbon but they are a weeded bourbon because they don't have rye in the mash bill, they have wheat in the malted barley and the corn, weller, like we were just talking about Weller, octan, the same thing. There's no rye in Weller. Like we were just talking about Weller, the same thing. There's no Ryan in Weller, the original, and then his sister, his cousin, pappy, same thing. So when you very rarely see, Is that?
Speaker 2:because you rarely see it, because it's either a rye or it's not a rye, like is it a bourbon or a rye. This is very temperamental to blend. Okay, because, like I know, eh Taylor has a special edition four grain that you rarely see, I know how much that is on the secondary market $1,000 plus $5.25.
Speaker 3:I priced it the other day $5.25? Did the other day $525? Did the cap just come down? Yeah, that used to be a lot higher. Well, remember before the pandemic. And then in the last 10 years secondary market prices have accelerated, but because of the downturn on things right now we're seeing it slide down again $525,.
Speaker 1:that's incredibly low.
Speaker 2:So now do they make it every year, because I think I have like a 16 and a 17 or something. You have one, yeah.
Speaker 3:It's limited release and when I pick up the four grain in Texas in a couple weeks I will let you know what year Okay.
Speaker 1:So it feels like he should have brought in that one as well, so we could do a four grain side by side.
Speaker 2:I mean that would have been nice Well and that was my question, true friend, they actually. It's crazy that they made they stated weeded bigger than the four grain. Yeah, is it just because four grain's more of an unknown and they would-.
Speaker 3:They don't want to Okay, this goes back to marketing and sales and helping the distillery sell as much as they can from these products. They're putting weeded on here for a reason and I firmly believe, without knowing the marketing team, that they're trying to go after Weller Because Weller's not in the field as much as you've seen.
Speaker 3:And then Maker's Mark doesn't present themselves as a weeded, even though they are, so they're going after a consumer that they're not trying to confuse. Okay. And again, if you look at all the Penelope on the shelf, everything they have now nice bookends, now five or six on the shelf at any given time, all the labels are different just because of that. Okay, this is just on the nose. Without this is tasty, this is crazy. It's 93 proof. I get that dryness, I get a little bit of the sweetness of the corn, the spiciness of the rye, but I really like the aromatics of the wheat, just on the nose. Do you get any cracked?
Speaker 1:vanilla in there, no, a little sugar plum and maybe a little bit of apple pie.
Speaker 2:It's really smooth too, like it's an easy, easy drink.
Speaker 3:This is incredible. I saw this the other day. I bought some Havana, I bought some Rio, so you saw this in Northwest.
Speaker 2:Arkansas, so I saw the Rio.
Speaker 3:I saw it in Texas and in Memphis a couple of weeks ago. Did you try the Rio yet? Yes, it's incredible, I dropped that into a lineup. In fact, I'm doing a whiskey dinner here in a couple months and the menu was sent to me today and they have Rio on it and I put Rio in there with the big meat portion of the menu. It's going to be perfect because of that Brazilian oak influence. That Brazilian oak is just striking. It's very aromatic. It kind of really kind of punches you in the mouth, but that really stands up to food.
Speaker 1:Does it share on here the percent rye and the percent breakout? Do they list that out? Because you know I'm not a rye fan? I'm not a rye fan. I'm tasting a little bit of the rye, but it's not overwhelming.
Speaker 3:It's soft on the rye. They don't have it on here. But, to your point, there's not as much rye because, again, when you think about this, when you see weeded and that's kind of your driver, that's your statement, that's what you're trying to tell the customers, that you have more wheat in here than anything else, just so it's a wheat or bourbon. That means they need to soften up the tone of the spiciness and the earthiness and the complexity of the rye, because the rye can attack that and overwhelm all the other grains if you don't balance it out, and I think this is a perfect balance. I tell you what I'm doing this for the first time.
Speaker 1:I haven't seen you be this excited about something in a long time, I mean this is exceptional.
Speaker 2:It's a sleeper Like you don't realize for $45. I have bottles that I paid I don't want to say it's in front of Carrie, but a lot and this towers over them I would have liked to have tasted the EH Taylor four grain side by side with this. Yeah, I mean do we Well, russ is going to have one in a few weeks. He said that's real quiet.
Speaker 1:You see, I'm going to just take that over to you.
Speaker 3:But I tell you what. There are other four grains out there. You know we can go around the region here and find some. How about if I just do a little research and find it and we'll do a four grain? Because again, I did bring back from my storage unit the bottles and bond for our bottles and bond challenge? We're going to do that one?
Speaker 2:Yeah, I do have one. I don't know if we should be talking about it now. Have you heard of the buff turkey bottles Like Buffalo Trace barreled some stuff for wild turkey. It's like 16 to 17 year bourbons. You have one, I have one of them. Where did you secure that? For some reason, Buffalo Trace sold the bottles and didn't barrel them and they just sold them to some smaller boutique bourbon companies. You didn't answer his question. A friend of mine he's like, has been researching it and found but he, I mean he has. I'll show you some of the labels afterwards.
Speaker 3:There's been a lot of horse trading. You know for years and you know, by the way. You know because BT and WT they're right next to each other, basically outside of Frankfurt. Yeah, so they're right there. So they're kissing cousins. Mm-hmm, I can't get over this. If I was blinding this, I'm hyping, I know you don't see me get this excited. No, and I'm not jaded, as you know.
Speaker 2:It's better without water. It's better without salt. I like it with the water.
Speaker 3:If I was judging this in competition, I'd give this another nipper. This is a solid gold medal on a blind test. That's big for you. It is.
Speaker 2:There's nothing really that I don't like. I like higher brief, but just to drink. Hey, you don't have to put ice, you don't have to do anything with this, and it's amazing.
Speaker 3:Well, thank you, Matt. This is a pleasant surprise.
Speaker 1:Look at you, I know, like a kid in a candy store. You're like the kid with the Christmas tree waiting for his presents. I know.
Speaker 2:Is this your first drink in six months? Yeah, it's like we're the gateway to get him back in. Well, you're going to have to put this into your lineup.
Speaker 3:Well, also, you know, I just took some sinus infection medicine.
Speaker 1:I could be explaining a lot of things right now.
Speaker 2:So if it's not good tomorrow, just take a little of that medicine and then drink.
Speaker 3:Okay, matthew, thanks for bringing this in. Thanks for this pleasant surprise. It's a good way to start off the late afternoon.
Speaker 2:Well and not being snooty, but you know how we all are, to be fair. You go into a liquor store, you browse the aisle and you look for the few unicorns and you walk right past this stuff.
Speaker 3:All right, can I tell you a story on that? Okay, so last week, case in point this is a perfect segue I'm in Austin last week doing an event and one of the attendees who's been to several of my events with his doctor, I had Russell's Reserve in the lineup 10-year. And he kind of looked at me like he was why do you have Russell's Reserve? He didn't know it was Wild Turkey, but he goes. I've walked by that brand at a liquor store a hundred times and never picked it up because I thought it looked cheap. Okay, but he, of the eight whiskeys in the lineup that day, he thought that was a favorite one of the eight. And I said this is the thing about my journeys, that I go and take people on and that new discovery that we've always done. This was a new discovery for him. And then I said now you're going. Well, what took me so long? He goes. Yeah, what took me so long? But now that was his favorite he goes. Of all, he's a big bourbon enthusiast.
Speaker 1:He goes for a $40 bottle of bourbon, he goes that could be my best economy brand that I've had in recent memory and I'm a fan again. What took you so long? Yeah, that new discovery. Well, people are again. They're. They're drinking what everybody tells them to drink, what everybody thinks is cool, what's allocated, what you can't find and, to your point, you're walking past a lot of good stuff. My intro the first one I ever tasted that like was the tx. You know the tx blended whiskey from, and I was. That was my intro. I'm like oh, this is kind of good. And my son, who's not quite 21, but he wants to sample bourbon asked me what he's trying. I go try that one if you want to try something, because just because it's not allergy doesn't mean it's not good and I think people get lost in that.
Speaker 3:We have been we have, unfortunately, through social media and different whiskey clubs and social media posts on whiskey clubs. The snobbery was way up there a couple years ago but it's toned down because now people can't get what they've been waiting to get their favorites and it's still not available. So they have to look for options, and these are great options as we wait for our favorite Buffalo Trace to come out, or our very rare wild turkeys, or, as we saw when we were in Kentucky in September, our favorite new heaven hill. You know we have to. And then again the other new discovery that we all found out in at Jim Bean, yeah, and at 16 yeah, I dropped that into a lineup a couple weeks ago for a corporate client. They go ah, just poo-pooed it because it had old granddad. And then they go what, this is old granddad. And I said, yeah, it's part of Jim Beam. Again, it just blew their mind, because again you start to soften that jaded tones on people and they start looking outside that box.
Speaker 1:When you bring up Jim Beam, though, I can't let you forgive you for the bunghole situation.
Speaker 2:Listen.
Speaker 1:I flamed out as soon as you said that I knew you were teeing it up. From now on I wasn't going to say anything. You knew I was going to.
Speaker 3:I flamed on that and I struck out.
Speaker 1:You're on a bad knee. You're on a bad knee. I'm not going to blame it on that. I'm going to blame it for you. Okay, thank you, I take ownership as soon as you said Jim Beam, you and I are feeling right over here. I like you on this side of the table. Cheers. Thank you, matthew. Good job, good job, matt. Nice seeing you guys, you too.